A Really Simple Lesson on Libertarianism
Monday, August 24, 2009Typically, I would not even waste my time. But since I have heard this type of stupidity repeated over and over again, throughout the libertarian blogosphere, it is worth addressing this one time. Look at this post and see the comment by “disinter” that states,
Good lord, this supposed “libertarian” site censors comments?
Barf.
The “barf” remark indicates the maturity level of the poster, but also, I wanted to post that so I could send this email to the poster to see how he responds to the very simple lesson. Here is my email to him:
Mr. No-Name:
Apparently you think the principles behind libertarianism give you the right to run roughshod all over my private property (hint, hint), and you think that moderating comments is “censorship?” Are you bleeping kidding me?
You can say or do what you want on your property, or on property where you have the permission of the owner to do so. You can take a wee wee on your dining room floor but you are not free to do so in my dining room. You can spray paint your lawn purple but you are not free to do so with my lawn. You can yell “fire” in your own backyard, but not in my backyard. You can say what you want on your blog but you are not free to do so on MY blog. On my blog I will not have sexual innuendos, crass comments, personal hatred, crude criticisms of other commenters, spam, other people advertising their blogs, or screwball whackos leaving comments that would be injurious to my character on a website that bears MY NAME. And that’s exactly what happens on a blog, like mine, that goes unmoderated.
Unlike most ”bloggers,” I am also a writer who is published in various publications, and I get paid for that. So there is also a professional credibility issue at stake. Also unlike most “bloggers,” I use my real name, my photo, and I list my profession and bio. My website is not that of a run-and-hide, chicken*** commenter. That is far too easy for people to do, which is why the majority of blogs are so completely ignorable.
What I do is not censorship – it is maintaining order and control over my own property so that, in the end, I am responsible for anything up there, whether I agree with the comments or not. Ultimately, the buck stops here because I do have accountability for everything that goes up on KDC.com. If I open up my blog (or my house) to any and all comers, I no longer have order and thus personal accountability becomes impossible. I assume your private property (house, car, etc.) is not open to any and all strangers?
Anyone who does not get this very simple concept and calls himself a libertarian is a joke and needs to find another ‘hobby’ besides libertarianism. May I suggest stamp collecting?
Here is the loser’s response back to me. He is: krateein@hotmail.com. He did exactly what I predicted, and I am loving it. No name on his email, of course.
Anyone who thinks they have to censor simple blog comments in order to make themselves feel important is a joke – a joke with a totalitarian mindset.
So the juvenile, tiny-brained totalitarian who demands the authority to corrupt and wreck someone else’s website calls one who defends that website “a totalitarian.” Unfortunately, libertarianism gets tainted by these assholes. Please feel free to go to disinter.wordpress.com and wreck his blog that no one reads.
UPDATE: All afternoon, an obsessed disinter has been harassing me by email (where he is now blocked), and he keeps on trying to post insane comments to my blog, making baiting remarks. Apparently, I got to him, and he thinks that he is bothering me somehow with his perpetual postings. It’s a great and simple thing on glorious WordPress — the delete button. Takes one-half of a second. Then you block the IP address. Now you know why people moderate their comments. There are some really crazy ****ers out there.
The Infamous Oregon Lawhobbit says:
August 24th, 2009 at 10:43 am
Oh come on, Karen. Two year olds are, by their very nature, selfish and undisciplined totalitarians. Fortunately some of us grow out of it, learning respect for others’ property along the way. Mr. Mouthbreather hasn’t matured that far yet, obviously, but maybe if he hangs around here long enough he’ll learn.
Or else die from holding his breath because he’s not getting his way.
Win-win scenario!
liberranter says:
August 24th, 2009 at 12:40 pm
Now that we’re in the initial stages of the worst full-fledged depression in human history, massive numbers of semi-literate state college graduates with degrees in “media studies”, “anthropology”, “ethnic studies”, and the like find themselves both unemployed and unemployable. This leaves them with lots of idle time on their hands, which they fill with acts of electronic vandalism, their favorite targets being libertarian bloggers who remind them of the foolishness of the choices they made, choices that have led them to their current predicaments. (“Disinter” appears to be such a creature, probably still occupying his childhood bedroom in his mommy’s house). You can expect many more such “visitors” as the Greatest Depression deepens.
Karen De Coster says:
August 24th, 2009 at 2:39 pm
Liberranter — almost half of all young college people I meet seem to be getting degrees in “environmental studies” or some other green offshoot. It makes those “Communications” degrees that athletes used to get look productive!
clark says:
August 24th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
I used to think partially along the same lines as this person – the whole censored comments bothered me some – but thanks to learning about property rights I could see why it wasn’t all that bad to censor comments. I think some of mine have been censored, but that’s ok, I figured they must’ve come across as stupid or something, which would reflect poorly on the host. The same as with a party? Some people go crazy at parties, i.e. Animal House, while other people party with respect for private property. NOW I know why parents didn’t want their teenagers having parties while they were away, teenagers often have no respect for private property and destruction results! After, “getting after” them, perhaps these people will reflect on things a bit and learn some? I know I never made a .0001″ error again after I got put down on the factory floor. It’s amazing how good a motivator, “put downs” are. But, then again, some people never learn.
Karen De Coster says:
August 24th, 2009 at 3:10 pm
Clark, none of yours have been “censored.” Since software is never perfect, sometimes comments accidentally end up in the spam folder and get deleted.
Michael the Artist says:
August 24th, 2009 at 8:57 pm
Wreck his blog, how?
Actually, never mind–you don’t want to give the government any ideas!
clark says:
August 24th, 2009 at 10:10 pm
Getting sent to the spam folder, that happens on blogs you can comment on instantly too – WordPress is known for that, I’ve read more than one blog owner cussing it.
Sean says:
August 25th, 2009 at 10:59 am
Did “disinter” state that you don’t have the right to moderate (a much more accurate word in this case than “censor”) comments on your blog? Disagreeing with that policy (or even calling it censorship) is not the same as saying you shouldn’t be allowed to do it. I don’t think people should be alcoholics, and I might say “Good Lord, this supposed healthy living advocate is drinking herself to death” without denying they have the right to do so.
Interesting how you also denigrate others as “bloggers”, as if non-professionals aren’t really blogging, or don’t deserve to be read if they aren’t getting paid for it. Sounds like you’re ready to join the mainstream dead tree media now, with that attitude, Karen.
As for using a real name, maybe you’ve never faced having to earn a living outside of writing, as an employee, where getting fired from your day job for expressing controversial opinions on the internet is a real possibility (yes, I know of several people to whom that has happened). Just one reason someone might not be eager to use their own name when blogging, or, as you so condescendingly refer to it, “blogging”.
Having said all that, I want to state that I don’t have a problem with anyone who chooses to moderate comments (nor do I think it is “censorship” in the common use of that word), and from your update, it indeed appears that this “disinter” is an ass who is now harassing you (and is only proving your point of course, so he/she is an obvious fool).
And as for calling you totalitarian, well, anyone who takes even a quick glance at your writing would see what an idiotic and ridiculous charge that is.
Thanks.
Mark T says:
August 25th, 2009 at 11:28 am
Karen,
I have to come here from time to time for some sanity. It’s amazing how many people of whatever political persuasion believe they have some “right” to post their drivel to any website that accepts comments.
Some fools even cry about their “First Amendment rights” being violated when their post gets deleted. You succinctly addressed the issue here. Unfortunately, that won’t necessarily stop this child from accessing his Mom’s computer while she’s at work.
If he/she doesn’t understand after your explanation, there’s no helping the fool. Keep up the good work – it helps my sanity.
Karen De Coster says:
August 25th, 2009 at 5:17 pm
Hi Sean — #1) disinter clearly made the charge that “censoring” (ummm, moderating) is _not compatible_ with libertarianism. He clearly implied that the two were at polar opposites. #2) He had absolutely no response to my comments except juvenile, personal comments, meaning he couldn’t back up his claims so he resorted to personal attacks. #3) Afterwards, he kept on posting comments to my blog, that I deleted, saying grossly puerile things, over and over again, thus exposing his real character and purpose on my blog. #4) I believe he has personally attacked me before on his blog that no one reads. #5) He rounded up his bored, immature friends (apparently he only has 2 or 3) to flame me with both emails and attempted comments to my blog, with all of them using crude and verbose language. Though I suspect it may have been him using various free email accounts. I can check the ISP. #6) If you were right, and you are not, #2, #3, and #5 would not have taken place. After all, I am clearly pro-criticism. But criticizing someone for alcohol, drugs, or perhaps being a prostitute is not a sufficient analogy for criticizing one for being a libertarian _and_ moderating comments. Unfortunately, libertarianism tends to draw a lot of young, “f*** you and leave me alone” juvenile-loser types who think that attitude is completely representative of libertarianism.
Karen De Coster says:
August 25th, 2009 at 9:00 pm
Sean, also, in response to this, I wanted to add something of importance:
“As for using a real name, maybe you’ve never faced having to earn a living outside of writing, as an employee, where getting fired from your day job for expressing controversial opinions on the internet is a real possibility (yes, I know of several people to whom that has happened).”
—————————–
I have a response to this that you may find interesting. What do you think I do for a living? I’m a Certified Public Accountant (so yes, my state can withdraw my certification and destroy my ability to make a living) – it’s in my bio. I don’t mow lawns or work at Home Depot, which would make things easy. I’ve worked in public accounting (partner-based CPA firms), where the firm is far more sensitive to your outside activities than any typical job. I’ve worked for 3 Fortune 500 firms, and have been in the financial services industry for 3+ years, working for a broker-dealer, in a business which is extremely sensitive to backgrounds of all employees. And want to hear the best thing? I’ve been FIRED by one of those firms for doing what I do on my own time, away from the company, on nights and weekends. I’ve been fired by an automotive industry company for my published opinions hammering on the Wall Street-government corporatist partnership and the financially insolvent auto companies. I bit the hand that fed my bosses their huge bonuses. I came right back and continued doing what I was doing, and continue to do it, and yes, every day is another day where I may be fired again. NO ONE knows this feeling better than me because I am not just a low-profile blogger who can be googled every now and then – I have had relationships with policy institutes, a state think tank, and published articles all over the place. I’ll speak at tea parties, Bircher meetings, radical gatherings, LP events, etc. And I will continue to do what I love, and what I think is so important. I will stay on the front lines and fight. No one will own or control my own time. If others are not courageous enough to stand up and do that, so be it. I don’t respect anonymous people who send anonymous emails and continue anonymous, obsessive attacks.
And one other LRC writer also got fired, 2 years before I did, for doing his thing on his own time.
clark says:
August 26th, 2009 at 12:34 am
Damn fine reply. I’m impressed as heck. Do pen names count? I always fancied pen names, much like, I think it was Edgar Allen Poe who used one, many knew who it was doing the writing so it wasn’t exactly anonymous, perhaps it even started out as a joke and never got dropped? Being as how my security is Not all that up to par, I also tend to follow the , “don’t use your real name ___ here” advise found on so many online programs, especially when I’m discussing uncomfortable truthful facts with hacker type people who might be inclined to steal my credit card or ID in retaliation for my position on an issue. It also helps to keep rocks from winding up in the front seat of ones car, via the windshield, that really was no fun and expensive, twice, never mind the missing radio or broken control panels. I never used a pen name to keep from being fired (that would be kind of cool) but to put the heat on the issue at hand rather than having the attention misdirected at the lame amateur author. And, maybe a little to avoid giving a reason for others to give my relations a rough time of it due to some controversial issue I’m trying to discuss and bring to the forefront. If I was lying and doing destruction, or just giving someone a hard time for no reason, that would be a different story altogether.
clark says:
August 26th, 2009 at 8:30 am
I towed a disabled boat back to shore once. I didn’t have to, and the owner wanted to pay me, he thought he knew who I was, I said I was not that person to avoid being paid. (Did you watch the movie Gran Torino? He didn’t want the food.) My other inspiration was The Dutch Farmer, the infamous pamphleteer of The Revolutionary War. I think intent and purpose makes a difference. Hopefully that inspires a modification in your thinking on anonymous posters. Otherwise I’ll just have to live with being lumped in together with the idiot juvenile harassers even though I think there can be merit in being someone who disguises his/her identity to avoid both the good and the bad consequences, among other reasons.
Steve Bernier says:
August 26th, 2009 at 10:16 am
Karen, personally, I want you to moderate. My thoughts are not always right or on topic. Any time you see me step out of line. Don’t let my words get published on your blog. I appreciate your stance on the issues that face us as citizens of the United States of which I am a citizen of Charlotte, Mecklenburg county, North Carolina.
Karen De Coster says:
August 26th, 2009 at 11:29 am
Steve, as much as I’d like to (for reasons of convenience), I can never go unmoderated. If only readers knew about the crazies and loons that we have that obsess on us, doing very bizarre things. These people would instantly take the opportunity to go apeshit on an unmoderated blog, turning it into a nightmare. The Internet encourages this behavior because there are little to no opportunity costs to doing such things, especially for folks with lots of time on their hands.